most convoluted knitting instructions ever

[piranha]

you have to know german knitting shorthand to understand this at all, but if you do, i want to know whether you grok this:

Nun beidseitig je 6 M stilllegen und über die mittleren 41 M glatt re str, dabei in der 1. R 19X2 M re zusammenstricken = 22 M. Außerdem 6x am Ende jeder Hinr die letzte M re abheben, 1 M des Seitenteils re str und die abgehobene M überziehen, wenden, die 1. M li abheben [der Faden ist vor der Arbeit] bis vor die letzte M str, dann diese M mit 1 M des Seitenteils li zusammenstricken, wenden und die 1. M li abheben [der Faden ist hinter der Arbeit]. Zugleich in jeder 4. R 4x je 2 M abnehmen; dafür die 3. M re abheben, die 4. M re str und die abgehobene M überziehen; bis 4 M vor Ende der R str, dann 2 M re zusammenstricken und die letzten 2 M str = 14 M. Nach der letzten Abnahme noch 16 R gerade hoch str. Nun weiter mit Nadel Nr. 4.5 und 1 Faden noch 20 R glatt re str, dann die M abketten.

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i am fluent in german and an intermediate knitter, so that's not the problem. it's just so confusingly written (what constitutes the "Seitenteil" is never defined; i am thinking it's the 6 stitches on both sides that have been laid aside in the first sentence). luckily i have a picture, though not a close-up, so i am hoping i'll be able to figure this out.

the depression really shows its ugly head in this; it requires concentration to hold several things at once in my head while performing a new task, and that runs up against my limits; very frustrating.

reference to the project in question: http://ravel.me/pi/3st

Comments

[seryn]

I'm not fluent in German so, no. This makes absolutely no sense. But you're asking about the knitting part, which I cannot evaluate.

What I do when confronted with patterns that confuse, I write out a copy of the directions (as I understand them) in my own notation and the stitch count I have (and number added/removed). At the end of the block, I compare what I would have numerically with what the pattern says. If the pattern doesn't specify, I try to find other people who have knitted it... often times there will be a blog post specifically addressing my issue.

However, since you're doing a German pattern, you're probably not going to run into a lot of ambient help.

If there's anyone who has made this on Ravelry, you could PM them and ask. There's also a translation group (don't remember what it's called, but I've seen official people pointing toward it, so I know it exists) who would probably be happy to help since you're not asking for a lot of help.

But my advice, when you're having problems thinking both knitting and German at the same time is to write it out again in your own knitting notation or make a chart. Then you're only worrying about the knitting part while getting your hands and brain connected via yarn.

And if this is kicking your ass too much, set it down, put your laundry in, wash your windows, shine your shoes, or put a facial mask on... something that's productive and useful but kind of sucks to do. That way when you come back to it you'll appreciate your knitting again. It's supposed to be fun. If it's not fun, do something else at least for a while.

[piranha]

the translation isn't the problem; it's the instructions themselves. german doesn't take up any extra space in my mind. it's the fact that there are several things that happen simultaneously in the instructions, which i can't hold in my mind at the same time. to translate it into some form of notation, i have to grasp it first. which is what's not working. in knitting i hate just to forge ahead because ripping back is such a pain compared to crochet; i tend to think the process through in my head instead of just trying it to see where it gets me.

i'm not really asking for help because nobody can fix my neurotransmitters. :) i am just writing out my frustration. and, well, on the off-chance that there is an error in the instructions, which somebody else might see.

thinking about it has been leading me to ponder what sort of program might aid in visualizing this sort of thing -- i am very much more visual when it comes to crafts than i am verbal; i prefer symbols over written instructions. a chart isn't working in part because it's 2D, and from the picture i think this is where the flat fabric becomes 3-dimensional. actually, just thinking about that is helping me; now that i am turning it in my mind i can derive what should happen to construct the ends so it looks kind of like the picture. it's not a construction method i've ever seen before... interesting.

thanks!

[seryn]

That's the real beauty of these comments... when the comment-reply gives you a chance to talk to yourself and work out the details. :-)

Congratulations on thinking first and again on explaining it to yourself. I'm pretty sure that makes you more than an intermediate knitter.

[matthewdaly]

I hear you. I've never tried knitting, but origami has a set of (I think) standard pictographs that indicate various folds and rotations, and even so it can still be a maddening process to figure out what they're doing. Give yourself a treat when you figure it out, eh?

I like your colors more than what I assume is the reference diagram. And I am entranced by the adjacent project in your flikr with the fans that are crocheted together or whatever the right handcrafty term is.

[piranha]

oh yes, origami -- very much a similar thing. i faltered at that a while ago when i saw a rather intricate design i would have loved to recreate, but i could not manage to follow the instructions. even though they were sequential, having to learn a new-to-me notation at the same time was too much, and the required effort became insurmountable. i am glad i already knew crochet and knitting symbols from years ago; if i had to learn them now, who knows how much effort that would take.

this is one of the most depressing (ha ha) aspects; that my ability to learn has been so badly impacted. i can no longer take college classes either; they're too demanding. and even my language studies stall all too easily, and i have to go over the same material over and over. (depression also affects memory transfer.)

i love the colours of this yarn; it basically jumped into my basket the moment i saw it. :) and yes, that scarf is crocheted, but instead of making all the motifs first and then putting them together, they're created on the fly. i admire that design.

[red_trillium]

Depression can get in the way of doing the things we want to do which would alleviate some of the effects of it. I don't know anything about knitting, nor German, so I can't help but I hope you're able to get it figured out without too much hassle.

[piranha]

Depression can get in the way of doing the things we want to do which would alleviate some of the effects of it.

yes, exactly, which is one of the things that makes it so insiduous -- enjoying a hobby is one thing, but it also keeps me from seeing a new doctor when things get worse, because it is such a huge effort to once again go through my entire history, and learn about that new doctor's preconceptions, and furthermore, i have to take a shower to go anywhere...

it sounds pitiful and pathetic, and people who don't suffer from it don't understand that one CAN'T just pull oneself up by the bootstraps. which includes way too many doctors.

[red_trillium]

I understand. My counsellor moved away and while she does come down sometimes for appointments it is far between. I don't have to go very often but when something happens or I'm not doing well I can't just call for an appointment. She says I can call or email her but due to some of my issues I'm not comfortable calling and talking to her and email isn't the same. I don't want to go through the hassle of finding another counsellor, going through all the background (40 years old, history of sexual abuse, divorce in the family, transgender, etc) with a new one.

I get pissed at people who basically say "get over it". You can't. It isn't about "getting over it". I think those types are the ones out of touch with reality.

[piranha]

*nod*. i hear you. and yes, if one could get over it just by wishing we'd get over it, i'd long have been cured. does anyone really think we WANT to be depressed? sheesh. sometimes i wish depression weren't invisible to others.

then again, considering how people interact with those who have visible illnesses, i'm not sure it'd gain us anything.

[red_trillium]

Yes, I have been getting something similar at work. One of my issues I'm struggling with in addition to depression right now is stress. I"m very stressed at work. I currently have a very high workload and this week has been the worse I've endured. The coming week (starting tomorrow) will be as bad, if not worse. I have tried to not let work bother me but it does. Yet there are people at work and in my life who say "just don't let it bother me". If I could "just not let it bother me" I would. My life would be much easier then!

And yeah, I agree, considering how people with visible illnesses are treated either it would actually be worse or just much the same.

[green_knight]

Ok, it's many years since I've knitted to instruction, but my impression is that this is a really really bad pattern.

What it does is go over the same ground several times: 'for x rows, do y' [while doing z in every row] [and by the way, you ought to have done d at the end of every second pass].

I would have to try this out - or block it out (I have, in the past, used waste yarn that could be easily unravelled and very large needles for this) to find out whether some of these instructions are sequential (first do x for 22 rows, then do y) or happening at the same time.

Your guess about the Seitenteil is better than mine.

Also, being confused by a very confusing thing is not a personal failing - I wouldn't have known where to start with this and I learnt to knit in German.

[piranha]

thanks! at least now i know it isn't just me.

i did get it to come out correctly, so there are no errors in the pattern; it's just written badly.